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The exodus of friends continues . . . - Persephone Yavanna the Entwife

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October 19th, 2005


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12:05 am - The exodus of friends continues . . .


diavola restroom


One of the side effects of being Evil Incarnate . . .

~~ sighs ~~

~~ twirls her pointy tail ~~

~~ sings Voltaire's "When You're Evil" to cheer herself up ~~

~~ twirls her pointy tail some more ~~

~~ starts to read "Pariah-hood for Dummies" ~~
Current Mood: sadresigned
Current Music: "When You're Evil" by Voltaire

(35 seeds eaten | Eat a pomegranate)

Comments:


[User Picture]
From:mowglikat
Date:October 19th, 2005 09:38 am (UTC)

attempting to be a voice of reason...

(Link)

a - continuing to announce yourself as evil is silly, and also not helpful to the situation. It is your LJ of course, and doing so is your right...but I'm not sure if there's any point that needs to be repeated over and over.

b - if you are losing friends over this, perhaps it would be wise to consider that the situation is not black and white, and there may be other valid points of view besides your own.

Truth is not a singular thing. It is a jewel with many facets. Which facets shine brightest depend on where you're standing, and where the light is coming from. But what is actually true is the entirety of the thing, not one facet at a time.
[User Picture]
From:theentwife
Date:October 19th, 2005 10:29 am (UTC)

Re: attempting to be a voice of reason...

(Link)
As to your first point -- It's an attempt at gallows humor Mowgli. And since I'm being treated as Evil Incarnate, I must be that -- right? Right? I'm trying to laugh at the situation, because it hurts too much to cry.

As to your second point -- People have started choosing sides -- and the side they are choosing is not mine. (I kind of expected that, given the others involved in this mess -- they have more and better social connections than I do.) And the loss of friends started before I made this post. The post simply reflects my mood and reaction to the rejection of people I have been friends with for most of a decade. It's not easy losing an entire circle of friends all at once.

While there may be other points of view besides mine, I dislike it intensely when my point of view is invalidated out of hand, which is something I do not do to others. And that has occurred repeatedly in this situation to me -- my point of view is dismissed without a second thought.

I do appreciate your comment though -- and your attempt at being a voice of reason. Thank you for that.


Persephone
[User Picture]
From:ms_redcat
Date:October 19th, 2005 12:29 pm (UTC)

Re: attempting to be a voice of reason...

(Link)
OK. I don't know the situation, other than the LJ comments. But anyway, *hugs hugs hugs* I'm sorry it hurts and sucks.
[User Picture]
From:theentwife
Date:October 19th, 2005 01:36 pm (UTC)

Re: attempting to be a voice of reason...

(Link)
Thanks for the hugs! They are much appreciated!!

I'd send you an email, but I'm not sure what email I can use for you now, given where you are. I still have your "RC" Hotmail & Yahoo e-ddresses in my address book -- should I use one of them? And if so, which do you prefer? (You can also just send me any new e-ddress you're using by sending me a note at the AOL address you know already or at the publicly listed Yahoo account in my user info -- your choice.)

BTW, I hope you have a nice time on your trip -- I look forward to reading your post(s) about it!


Persephone
[User Picture]
From:schwarzewitwe
Date:October 21st, 2005 01:28 am (UTC)

Re: attempting to be a voice of reason...

(Link)
Same situation here. You need to purge any poisonous people you know from your life; you deserve to be happy.
[User Picture]
From:theentwife
Date:October 21st, 2005 01:40 am (UTC)

Re: attempting to be a voice of reason...

(Link)
Same situation here.

Sorry to hear that. :(

you deserve to be happy.

Thank you -- so do you.

{{{{{{{{{{{Hannah}}}}}}}}}


Persephone
[User Picture]
From:mowglikat
Date:October 19th, 2005 03:10 pm (UTC)

Re: attempting to be a voice of reason...

(Link)
And since I'm being treated as Evil Incarnate, I must be that -- right? Right?

No...I think you're just really really angry. And nobody resolves anything by speaking to really really angry people. Speaking to them is fruitless until they're not so angry.

and the side they are choosing is not mine. (I kind of expected that, given the others involved in this mess -- they have more and better social connections than I do.)

...Now 'seph....surely you know this group of friends better than that. 85-90% of them would not choose a side at all unless they felt involved or insulted in some way. (I can't speak for the other 10-15%, but I'd venture they're mostly similar.) Them choosing one side or another I'm sure has little or nothing to do with social connections or being friends with folks. That's a very high school mentality, and this circle of friends has evolved past that. You're remembering a feeling you had when you were younger, and it's poking you in the eyes so you can't see clearly. What is happening now is not what happened then (regardless of whatever "then" was) and has all its own ire associated with it. It doesn't need extra historical ire that it isn't a part of, if you know what I mean.

While there may be other points of view besides mine, I dislike it intensely when my point of view is invalidated out of hand, which is something I do not do to others. And that has occurred repeatedly in this situation to me -- my point of view is dismissed without a second thought.

I've been reading the posts back and forth, and I do not see this being done to you. I see you doing this to other people, instead. I think it's important to tell you this because I don't think that you're seeing it, and it feels important.

It appears to me that what is happening is happening because you are treating people in the way that you believe you are being treated, but are not actually being treated. As a result, people are frustrated, and choosing sides.

Again, please realize, I'm sure I'm saying some unpleasant things. I'm not saying them to insult or to injure. I'm saying them because I'm concerned, and I don't like to see you in pain, and in order to address that, these things need to be talked about. If your binary switch flips, and you need to stop being friends with me, I'll understand...I lose quite a bit of friends that way. But I don't get the impression that's the kind of relationship we have, so I don't feel in danger of that at the moment.

If we're getting close to that point, though, let me know.
[User Picture]
From:theentwife
Date:October 19th, 2005 10:45 pm (UTC)

Re: attempting to be a voice of reason...

(Link)
Due to comment length restrictions, my reply will have to be in several parts. Sorry about that.

I'm sure I'm saying some unpleasant things. I'm not saying them to insult or to injure. I'm saying them because I'm concerned, and I don't like to see you in pain, and in order to address that, these things need to be talked about.

I agree -- and that is the heart of the problem here -- lack of communication and differing definitions of certain terms -- definitions that have been inadequately communicated, causing multiple misunderstandings and misinterpretations. And a lot of pain -- pain that might have been avoided if all parties had been "on the same page".

I thank you for your concern and I appreciate it deeply -- maybe more than you realize. I can see that you are doing the best you know how to make things better -- and I appreciate that deeply also.

If your binary switch flips, and you need to stop being friends with me, I'll understand...I lose quite a bit of friends that way. But I don't get the impression that's the kind of relationship we have, so I don't feel in danger of that at the moment.

You aren't in any danger of that -- not from me.

Them choosing one side or another I'm sure has little or nothing to do with social connections or being friends with folks.

There we might have to agree to disagree. Some of the people involved have been friends with others for years longer than those others have known me (decades in some cases) -- and are also much closer friends than with me. There are several people who are like that involved in this.

Were I to be at a gathering, say at someone's house, where there are several of these people present, there would end up being an underlying current of disharmony -- a disruption of the wa of the group -- due to me. The others get along fine without me -- but if I am around, I would be bringing tension and disharmony in by my very presence.

I am only one person -- there are several others who get along fine with one another, but not with me. One versus several -- who is it better not to have around for the overall harmony of the group?

Answer -- the one. It is the logical choice, given the circumstances. "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. Or the one."

Some have already disassociated themselves from me -- frankly I expect others to follow. In some cases, I have decided that even if I am invited to certain events, it would be best not to come, for the afore-mentioned reason -- to me it would not be right to spoil an event for others by my being present and causing there to be social tension. This has already been communicated to one person, so she would know the reason why I would be declining her kind invitations to me -- and it will also be communicated to others, if need be, on an as-needed basis. To me, it is the right thing to do -- I have no desire to be a party pooper or to feel that my presence is unwanted.

You might claim that that is "a very high school mentality" -- and to a certain extent you would be correct. High school is a living laboratory for adolescents to practice the group dynamics of social interactions that take place in the adult world. These exact same interactions take place constantly among adults -- but there they are often referred to as "internal politics". I have no desire to be a "political problem" -- certainly no more so than I already am!!

Persephone
[User Picture]
From:mowglikat
Date:October 19th, 2005 11:31 pm (UTC)

Re: attempting to be a voice of reason...

(Link)
I am only one person -- there are several others who get along fine with one another, but not with me. One versus several -- who is it better not to have around for the overall harmony of the group?

No one has yelled at you, told you you are being stupid, or said that they can't be friends with you. Not until you became hostile. You are choosing to be a "political problem" by insisting that everyone must hate you, because no one is listening to you. In reality, people have contacted you and apologized to you. You have responded with harshness and anger.

I'm not saying you don't have a right to be angry. I'm saying that it seems to be natural to you to jump to victim status at the earliest opportunity, thereby creating a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Life does not have to be like this. Things can change if you want them to. But you have to look at it and SEE it. Right now it's like you're doing anything to NOT see it. I'll explain in the other post.
[User Picture]
From:theentwife
Date:October 19th, 2005 10:56 pm (UTC)

Re: attempting to be a voice of reason...

(Link)
Continuation of the above comment:


"And that has occurred repeatedly in this situation to me -- my point of view is dismissed without a second thought."

I've been reading the posts back and forth, and I do not see this being done to you.


This statement leads me to the conclusion that we are not perceiving the same things. Therefore, I think it necessary to give specific examples, with the messages I am receiving from them. Please forgive me if the tone comes across as possibly being condescending -- it is honestly not meant to be so -- I am simply making an attempt to provide clarity to this murky situation.

In this comment, I am referred to as someone who prefers to "play the victim" -- I found this term to be dismissive, as though I were playing some kind of mind game. I am not. I feel that I have a legitimate grievance that is not being heard. Using the term "play the victim" makes me receive the message that the person making that comment considers that my grievance is not valid and that what I say will be ignored.

In this comment, "I hope you can gain some perspective on it eventually..." causes me to receive another dismissive message. I am receiving the message that the writer thinks that my viewpoint needs to be altered -- that it is not in accord with reality. Again, invalidation of my viewpoint -- dismissal out of hand.

I as well as others were also able to see that I was being baited by this same writer. (I know you did not -- that is why I am pointing this out here.) I did not take kindly to that, particularly when the entry in her journal belied her seemingly-kind comment -- there was a discord there that I pointed out, point by point. I admit to being both bitter and sarcastic at times there, but I felt that I was being provoked and needed to reply to her comment to point out the inconsistencies of her statements. The dissonance between what she said in one place versus what she said in another really grated on my nerves, especially when she was being dismissive of my point of view.

I think you're just really really angry.

No -- I'm hurt. Very, very, VERY hurt. I admit to flashes of anger in this post and its comments and in this comment -- shown mostly with sarcasm -- but my main emotion is hurt -- deep gut-wrenching pain. (You can tell my mood pretty easily usually based on what icon I use for a post or a comment.)

I feel as though the one I love so deeply has abandoned me in favor of someone else -- someone newer and shinier. There no longer is space in his life for me -- I have been replaced. When there is time for someone else, but not for me, the message I receive from that is that I am no longer wanted or cared for, that I am no longer important to him. And that message hurts me very much and very deeply.

I want nothing more than to have him take me into his lap and kiss me and cuddle me and be truly loved and wanted by him.

But I can't have that. It was hard enough for me to be second-best always -- now I'm third-best, if I'm even as high as that. I feel as though I'm just a name on a list -- and my name isn't even near the top. Not anymore.

The pain of that realization was more than I could bear, especially when my nose was repeatedly rubbed in it.


Persephone the Broken-Hearted
[User Picture]
From:burnstr2
Date:October 20th, 2005 01:39 am (UTC)

Kia Ora

(Link)
More huggs {{{{{{{{{{{{{{{Perse}}}}}}}}}}}}}} hope you are okay my old mate =( Hey I quit my job start a new one in a few weeks so is kinda hard to get on AIM right now. But would love to say Kia ora! Do you have a number I could call you on? If so would like to say hi but let me knoe the time diff do would not like to call at like 2am hehe. Just email me my work one is still fine andy@vantagewindows.co.nz

huggs and kisses

Andy =7
[User Picture]
From:theentwife
Date:October 20th, 2005 05:29 am (UTC)

Re: Kia Ora

(Link)
Hallo Andykins!!!!

Thank you for the hugs -- they are much appreciated!!!!!

You need to get a home computer!! Then you could call me for free using Skype.

Phone info will be sent in an email to you -- I'd love to hear from you, no matter what time of day or night! As you know I'm often a night-owl, so 2 am calls are peachy keen with me. :) I think the time difference is about 12 hours -- or close to that.

I'm happy you have a new job all lined up -- you have to tell me alllllll about it!!!!


Persephone
[User Picture]
From:burnstr2
Date:October 20th, 2005 01:44 am (UTC)

shoping

(Link)
I got all this cash to spend but just can't seem to find a magic shop I got 60 viles of HW and need to buy scrols of turn lots of them so I can go find Janus lol Janus lost in shadow at fir and 92nd =P
[User Picture]
From:theentwife
Date:October 20th, 2005 05:39 am (UTC)

Re: shoping

(Link)
Oooooooooooooooo -- Janus is gonna get it but GOOD!

:D

GO ANDY!!! GO ANDY!! RAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!

Don't forget to pick up some Garlic Spray also -- if you have Shadows 3 you can use two of those at a time. :)

It wouldn't hurt to have a few Displacement and Teleport scrolls too, in case he tries to flee or you want to discombobulate him.


Persephone
[User Picture]
From:burnstr2
Date:October 20th, 2005 07:15 pm (UTC)

Re: shoping

(Link)
Powers: Second-sight Suction Surprise Perception Celerity(3) Stamina(3) Shadows(3) Thievery(3) Locate(3) Telepathy(3) Charisma(3)
Money: no coins
Possessions:
Scroll of Turning (31)
Scroll of Teleportation (10)
Scroll of Displacement (10)
Scroll of Succour (1)
Vial of Holy Water (60)
Garlic Spray (5)
Location: Qualms and 82nd
You are sire to 2 other vampires, including: cobber (64 pints), Icedancer (4 pints)
You are a second-generation vampire. Your sire is TheEntwife (28057).


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